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Post by derbydad on Nov 14, 2006 10:14:01 GMT -6
Since BSA rules typically don’t allow “H” or grooving of the tires, I was wondering about inserting the axils at a slight angle so the tires (while flat in construction) would ride on their inside edges, thus reducing friction.
Thoughts or ideas would be appreciated. Thanks.
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Post by slkrnsntracing on Nov 14, 2006 10:25:18 GMT -6
Since BSA rules typically don’t allow “H” or grooving of the tires, I was wondering about inserting the axils at a slight angle so the tires (while flat in construction) would ride on their inside edges, thus reducing friction.Thoughts or ideas would be appreciated. Thanks. derbydad, I raced stock for 5 months and had to go to a live event to discover that the fast cars were doing exactly what you brought up. You're way ahead of me. Now when are you going to be sending a car to the races? Good luck Phil
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Post by gtobob on Nov 14, 2006 12:18:23 GMT -6
How much of an angle is required? It seems like the axles would have to take out all the slop in the wheel bore and STILL be angled up to have the wheel ride on the top of the outside bore and the bottm of the inside bore. I have been trying for a neutral axle, doesn't roll in, doesn't roll out. This idea means the wheel rolls on the axle head ALL the time. Is that right SLKRNSNT? Because if that's correct, the polishing of the nail head is more important than polishing the shaft.
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Post by WarpSpeedINC on Nov 14, 2006 12:32:25 GMT -6
How much of an angle is required? It seems like the axles would have to take out all the slop in the wheel bore and STILL be angled up to have the wheel ride on the top of the outside bore and the bottm of the inside bore. I have been trying for a neutral axle, doesn't roll in, doesn't roll out. This idea means the wheel rolls on the axle head ALL the time. Is that right SLKRNSNT? Because if that's correct, the polishing of the nail head is more important than polishing the shaft. We have found to get the proper amount of camber for this set-up, the axles need to be angled anywere from 2-3 degrees (depending on axle to axle bore clearance). You want to get just the right amount, to just lift the outer edge of the wheel off of the track, any more and the wheels start to spin, or scrub on the track surface instead of rolling. Also, you need to make sure this new surface you are running on is just as true to the axle bore centerline as the tread surface is. Otherwise, you may lose any gain you might have found otherwise. Good Luck!! Warp Speed
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Post by slkrnsntracing on Nov 14, 2006 13:04:05 GMT -6
I have been trying for a neutral axle, doesn't roll in, doesn't roll out. This idea means the wheel rolls on the axle head ALL the time. Is that right SLKRNSNT? gtobob, I tried the same thing. I was trying to align my PWD cars like you would a car(automobile). When I was at Lima I looked at one of Warp's cars, and the wheels were angled out at the bottom. Then I got looking at all the other good running cars, and they were the same. I still couldn't believe it, but I was assured it was the way to do it. I'm trying to get my cars aligned more like Warp said, but my wheels have been thru too many wars on the track, in the mail, and by my modifications that they aren't near as true as they used to be. I have a new set of Warps wheels that I'm going to get out of the box for next year. Good luck. Phil
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Post by derbydad on Nov 14, 2006 15:51:22 GMT -6
Hey, Hey, Hey.. out on the track with you guys... don't think so.. not yet any way ;D I'm still in the thinkin', plannin' & learnin' phase. This will be the first PWD car I've touched in 30 years. My 7 yr old son is almost as excited about this as I am.. ;D On the other hand I've scared my wife ;D She's isn't unaware of my plans for a test track yet!! So.. were not worthy to be on the track with you guys - yet. Soon-. In the meantime we would like to be spectators and check you fast guys out. How do I find out locations and race dates? Thanks again for being a very helpful resource. The Derby Dad.
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hotrod
Head in the Pine
Posts: 136
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Post by hotrod on Nov 14, 2006 18:59:40 GMT -6
Hey guys, is it possible to cant front axle if you are a rail rider? If so, I would appreciate comments or suggestions. I have tried it without much success. One of my stockers has canted axles on the rear but not on the front. The front wheel does really funny things when you rotate a bend axle in canted slot or hole. thanks Ed Half Moon Racing
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Post by RAIL HUGGER on Nov 14, 2006 22:04:40 GMT -6
Last year my son dropped his car in the basement just after tuning,the right front was bent upward a bunch and just to humor him I said let's try it now to my amazement the car was .020 faster. this car is a railrider and I can't quote the degree of camber but I can tell you the axle mark is in the 12:30 position and if you rotate it back to 12:00 or forward to 1:00 the car gets all kind of squirly. it's very sensitive. Hey guys, is it possible to cant front axle if you are a rail rider? If so, I would appreciate comments or suggestions. I have tried it without much success. One of my stockers has canted axles on the rear but not on the front. The front wheel does really funny things when you rotate a bend axle in canted slot or hole. thanks Ed Half Moon Racing
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Post by WarpSpeedINC on Nov 15, 2006 5:56:27 GMT -6
Hey guys, is it possible to cant front axle if you are a rail rider? If so, I would appreciate comments or suggestions. I have tried it without much success. One of my stockers has canted axles on the rear but not on the front. The front wheel does really funny things when you rotate a bend axle in canted slot or hole. thanks Ed Half Moon Racing If you are going to run canted, keep the bend in the dominant front axle to a minimum. You will need very little to do your steering with, as the built in axle angle from canting will exagerate adjustments, and can make it VERY hard to find the "sweet spot" if the axle has too much bend in it. It will still require a little, but not half as much as running straight up. Just be carefull not to over do anything. Just enough cant to lift the outer edge of the wheel, just a slight (.002-3) bend in the axle for steering. You may find some speed with this set-up, but as with anything on these cars, the farther you get outside the box, the less room there is for error! Warp Speed
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GILLS
Pine Head
Posts: 49
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Post by GILLS on Nov 15, 2006 21:15:06 GMT -6
Hey derbydad, I canted the wheels on my son's pwd car 3 years ago and was successful at it. Here is a link to a picture of the car: grandprix-race-central.com click on photo gallery and under search type in gold medal and it will pull up. You can see that I cambered the outside edge of the tire down about 1-3 degrees. You can see the silver graphite trail on the outermost edge of both rear wheels and the left front wheel. Here is the critical part, I very carefully checked the fit of the axle to the slot, and it was tight, so I carefully shaved the opening a hair wider on the bandsaw. I was going for a snug, not super tight fit. Next I Inserted the wheel and axle in the slots and I started with the rear of the car. I placed the car upside down on one of the wife's good bathtowels and I took a flathead screwdriver and gently tapped the sharp end of the axle deeper into the car body which would lift the inner edge of the wheel. This raised the wheel end of the axle about 1/32" to maybe 1/16" out of the wood slot. I repeated this on the other side and I would just visually check for an even camber between the two. I repeated this on the left front until I had it even with the rear whheels. I raised the right front completely off the ground. Finally, do a simple tracking check by sweeping a 10' to 16' clean path on your garage floor and tap the car and watch it roll. If it goes straight most of the way you're fine if not check to see which wheel is out. Last thing to do once you get it tracking o.k., is take some GEL SUPERGLUE, not regular! and place some on the lower half of your axle nails to help lock them in place.
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Post by derbydad on Nov 16, 2006 23:49:40 GMT -6
I went to the site but nothing was found by searching "gold medal". Suggestion. Thanks
Derby Dad
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Post by pwgrasshopper on Nov 17, 2006 8:12:45 GMT -6
I had the same problem finding the photo at first.
Try this: click on his link bringing you to the home page, then click on Photo Gallery, then you should see a Photo Search option at the top of the page, enter gold medal and you should be in business.
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HyperDrive
Head in the Pine
Magnum Force
Posts: 243
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Post by HyperDrive on Nov 17, 2006 16:03:08 GMT -6
Hey derbydad, I canted the wheels on my son's pwd car 3 years ago and was successful at it. Here is a link to a picture of the car: grandprix-race-central.com click on photo gallery and under search type in gold medal and it will pull up. under photo gallery --go to "visitors submissions" then to page 4 and there it is. Hyperdrive
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Post by derbydad on Nov 18, 2006 15:46:40 GMT -6
Thanks. Found it.
Derby Dad
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